A Hard Days Night doctoring/reshooting

[Perplexed]

It's the rhizome placement.

Paperback Writer, too.

[TotalInformation]

IMO, it's the same person.

Nope. Different nose, different ears. Differntly-shaped head.

Pull yourself together.

[Perplexed]

totalinformation said:

When would Paul McCartney have learned all that?

He was wise beyond his years, the genius prodigy of the deliberately engineered Liverpool musical mileu, burdened by esoteric knowledge even moreso than his bandmates.

It wouldn't have been a problem.

You've made the case for Help! reshoots, but haven't quite done so yet for AHDN. However, do recall that AHDN was "digitally remastered" before its rerelease about 10 years ago...

I'd prefer to think Paul was a genius at the writing and formulating of the music. In great conjunction with Geo. Martin.

The reason I haven't even made a start concerning AHDN, is that I simply can't. An entrance or two, a brief pass in a hallway, and a few frames in the final concert scene are the only theings that even begged scrutiny. And when I did, I couldn't tell anything by it. AHDN is consistent with Paul's appearence from stem to stern.
I find nothing in it to point out here. Except, IMO,

It's the best movie the Beatles made.

[Perplexed]

totalinformation said:

IMO, it's the same person.

Nope. Different nose, different ears. Differntly-shaped head.

Pull yourself together.

I see the differences, too. They may can be accounted for in other ways? Well, I dunno. It was my impression. I'm not improvising just to be a nuisance--I really see the same man, and so does my friend who has done movie make-up since the mid-80's. He thinks I'm nuts and it's ALL the same guy.

Pull yourself together.

I know. It's really sad, isn't it?

[beatled]

I made some screen grabs of the VHS version, these are to my perception anyway, quite in the JPM part of the spectrum.

Notice in the last still, he is holding a fake nose. (just clowning around in the dressing room) Ironic?

http://*banned link*/Shoebox/AHDN_VHS_Stills/AHDN_VHS1.jpg[/img]

http://*banned link*/Shoebox/AHDN_VHS_Stills/AHDN_VHS2.jpg[/img]

http://*banned link*/Shoebox/AHDN_VHS_Stills/AHDN_VHS3.jpg[/img]

http://*banned link*/Shoebox/AHDN_VHS_Stills/AHDN_VHS4.jpg[/img]

http://*banned link*/Shoebox/AHDN_VHS_Stills/AHDN_VHS5.jpg[/img]

http://*banned link*/Shoebox/AHDN_VHS_Stills/AHDN_VHS6.jpg[/img]

http://*banned link*/Shoebox/AHDN_VHS_Stills/AHDN_VHS7.jpg[/img]

[plastic paul]

The last pic looks like bill to me.

I still haven't got round to watching the film again yet but i have the case in front of me as i type and here are my observations (for reference, check out the "2 disc collectors edition" of AHDN)

1) Pictures on front of the boys, its bill.

2) Picture on back of band playing, its bill.

3) Scene selection list etc booklet inside, cover is a reprint of point 1) but inside i think they are original pics with JPM.

I'm also amazed at how "clean" the old man is ;D

[Perplexed]

Well, no one may agree--but
Paul, Paul, Paul, not sure, William,not sure, Paul, William--but I'm a little confused now. (or a lot..)

But, who is this legendary figure:


I'll say who it is tomorrow if no one already knows.

[TheDZ]

IMO all those pics JoJo posted are JPM. If they've been
monkeyed with, it's been with JPM as the base.
No reshoots in AHDN IMO. YMMV

[plastic paul]

I understand what you are sayind DZ but wouldnt it have been easier for them to reshoot?

I dunno who he is perplexed but he's got a hand behind him so he MUST be dead!

[ReallyReallyDead]

can anyone grab that scene I was talking about, in the concert scene, when (supposedly) Paul's face fills the screen, and they are singing "somethingsomethingsomethingsomething that I would love to love you."
I watched it over and over on the DVD and noticed that this person had the same movements and facial expresiones as Faul. Ones that I have never seen Paul do. (Of course, I havent seen many videos of Paul)

[defhermit]

perplexed said:

Well, no one may agree--but
Paul, Paul, Paul, not sure, William,not sure, Paul, William--but I'm a little confused now. (or a lot..)

But, who is this legendary figure:


I'll say who it is tomorrow if no one already knows.

I'd say it was some famous chick dressed up as a dude. Lily Tomlin? Gilda Radner?

[TheDZ]

plasticpaul said:

I understand what you are sayind DZ but wouldnt it have been easier for them to reshoot?

Easier to re-shoot than..?
Digital image manipulation has been in use for some time.
Frame alteration done manually has been done for ages.
Some old movies were hand colored. Animated cartoons
were hand drawn.

I'm not saying that any of that was done with AHDN.
It might have been though.

The logistics of reshooting seem a bit extravagant when
others means are just as/more effective.
Think about all the footage in the wild...
all the stuff they couldn't hoover up.
Subtle doctoring makes more sense to me.

However, even with the DVD of AHDN I see JPM all the way.
I won't say that it hasn't been altered in Bills direction,
just that I still see Paul.

[plastic paul]

Right well i finally got round to watching AHDN again, and it's just finished so here are my observations. I unfortunately don't have the means to take photo's from the film and then post them up, however if someone deems it necessary for arguments purpose then by all means please do.

Ok here goes, all times are approximate BTW.

7.00mins When the older businessman is on the train complaining etc i definitely see Faul, Yet when explaining who his grandfather was moments earlier i was certain it was JPM

at around 10.00 mins there is a side view where his ears look fake leading me to believe it was Faul once again.

19.30 mins at the party, paul is winking, nudging etc as well as doing the famous "A OK" sign, which i have only ever seen Faul do so in this case i'd say it was faul due to body language.

At a few moments in the film i noticed that he looked very much like the LSD interview paul, noticably so at 38.00 and 1.03.00.

I'm not sure (this is where a pic would be ideal) but i thought i could see a scar on his lip during "and i love her" where they show a close up of one of the TV monitors, which correlates to a year or two later and the moped incident, is that correct?

And finally...... at the end of the film where they do the medley, at 1.15.00 during If I fell and at 1.20.00 during she loves you, i could say almost for certain that it was not JPM IMO.

If you can check these out for yourself, let me know what you think.

PS. throughout most of the film it seems to me that George and "Paul" appear to be the same height, which as it so happens appears considerably taller than john and of course, ringo.

[Perplexed]

I am fresh out of guesses on AHDN, and I'll need to get it and seen again, as, its been quite a while.
Again, I just thought that it was very very consistent, in terms of Paul's appearance. I don't have any more to add to that.

For those who know the artist and recognise the album cover, the funky charactor I posted above is the divinely gifted Ms. Joni Mitchell. She is still herself, thankfully, but, word is, that for an occasion or two in the past she enjoyed dressing up as her alter ego, "Art Nouveau". I think I read somewhere that she attended a big party 'round the mid-80's in such a persona, and left some guests guessing......

I'll post the full album cover tomorrow-----that's actually HER hand sticking out in the picture there--she's very much alive.

"Don Juan's Reckless Daughter"

[Ludwig]

This talk of digital enhancement regarding AHDN, Help! and the Anthology leads me back to a theory I've been working on that ties in Michael Jackson and may even explain some of the trouble he has been having and will have again. It is a fact that Faul and M.J. worked together and M.J. gained control of something Faul definitely wanted. The catalog. M.J, knowing a thing or too about facial reconstruction was a perfect choice to maintain the Beatles catalog as he is a master at fooling all of the public all of the time. Honestly, can any of us really say that the guy that appeared in court every day of the trial was really Michael Jackson? Thriller? Jackson 5?
SO, M.J. and co. could have easily enlisted the help of another master of trickery, old friend director John Landis, who shot "Thriller" and the "Black or White" videos, which featured (drum roll please) digital morphing the same technique used in Terminator 2 and Forrest Gump, to oversee the assembly of the Anthology and the re-mastering of AHDN, etc. Landis also directed Spies Like Us, featuring Faul's title track, and was/is no stranger to Abbey Road Studios having worked with composer Elmer Bernstein numerous times. I guess y'all see where this is going. Digital alteration is more than a reality to these people. It's their trade and they are masters of illusion. Deception. The suspension of disbelief. Glen or Glenda. POOL DA STRINKS!

www.fantamorph.com/
www.jpgr.co.uk/r6118.html

[defhermit]

This has nothing to do with it, but John Landis also directed Twilight Zone the Movie, and was almost sent to jail for directing the film shoot where the leading man and a few vietnamese girls were killed when a helicopter landed on them... he got off, but it was a whole big thing. He also puts "See You Next Wednesday" in all his movies...

[Ludwig]

I remember that. Vic Morrow was the actor and if I recall correctly he jumped into a pool or something in an attempt to save the girls from danger. Weird. See you next Wednesday? At five o'clock?

“See You Next Wednesday!” features in many John Landis films as a bit of a trademark. Featured in different ways, it’s believed to have come from a particular line in Kubrick’s 2001 where Frank Pool’s parents are giving him a birthday greeting and sign off with the line “See You Next Wednesday!”. Also the name of Landis’s first screenplay.

[Perplexed]

ludwig said:

This talk of digital enhancement regarding AHDN, Help! and the Anthology leads me back to a theory I've been working on that ties in Michael Jackson and may even explain some of the trouble he has been having and will have again. It is a fact that Faul and M.J. worked together and M.J. gained control of something Faul definitely wanted. The catalog. M.J, knowing a thing or too about facial reconstruction was a perfect choice to maintain the Beatles catalog as he is a master at fooling all of the public all of the time. Honestly, can any of us really say that the guy that appeared in court every day of the trial was really Michael Jackson? Thriller? Jackson 5?
SO, M.J. and co. could have easily enlisted the help of another master of trickery, old friend director John Landis, who shot "Thriller" and the "Black or White" videos, which featured (drum roll please) "Fantamorph" the same digital morphing technique used in Terminator 2 and Forrest Gump, to oversee the assembly of the Anthology and the re-mastering of AHDN, etc. Landis also directed Spies Like Us, featuring Faul's title track, and was/is no stranger to Abbey Road Studios having worked with composer Elmer Bernstein numerous times. I guess y'all see where this is going. Digital alteration is more than a reality to these people. It's their trade and they are masters of illusion. Deception. The suspension of disbelief. Glen or Glenda. POOL DA STRINKS!

www.fantamorph.com/
www.jpgr.co.uk/r6118.html

Bingo.

[abbey]

I am pretty sure HDN was Paul and so was Help. They are probably dubbing Bill in, but the original was all Paul.

Too bad there wasn't VHS back then and we would have copies of that which was sold in 1965

[TheDZ]

ludwig said:

This talk of digital enhancement regarding AHDN, Help! and the Anthology leads me back to a theory I've been working on that ties in Michael Jackson and may even explain some of the trouble he has been having and will have again. It is a fact that Faul and M.J. worked together and M.J. gained control of something Faul definitely wanted. The catalog. M.J, knowing a thing or too about facial reconstruction was a perfect choice to maintain the Beatles catalog as he is a master at fooling all of the public all of the time. Honestly, can any of us really say that the guy that appeared in court every day of the trial was really Michael Jackson? Thriller? Jackson 5?
SO, M.J. and co. could have easily enlisted the help of another master of trickery, old friend director John Landis, who shot "Thriller" and the "Black or White" videos, which featured (drum roll please) digital morphing the same technique used in Terminator 2 and Forrest Gump, to oversee the assembly of the Anthology and the re-mastering of AHDN, etc. Landis also directed Spies Like Us, featuring Faul's title track, and was/is no stranger to Abbey Road Studios having worked with composer Elmer Bernstein numerous times. I guess y'all see where this is going. Digital alteration is more than a reality to these people. It's their trade and they are masters of illusion. Deception. The suspension of disbelief. Glen or Glenda. POOL DA STRINKS!

www.fantamorph.com/
www.jpgr.co.uk/r6118.html

The video for Say,Say,Say I thought was quite interesting...
Traveling snake oil salesmen , vaudeville act, traveling road show...
I'm don't think a really recent fade has been done , but this
xoomer.virgilio.it/james_paul_mccartney/mj.html
is relatively recent. It's the same guy or rather it's the same cranium under that mask if you know
what I mean, but wow what a lot of work done! Amazing!

The thing about MJ is, he has done a very interesting thing.
Admittedly it is odd, but here's the thing...If a person
made up to look just like him did some nasty things, MJ
might have a hard time staying out of trouble. Perhaps
he's covering his behind by changing his looks constantly.
A moving target so to speak.
MJ exhibits signs of being programmed(Peter Pan) as well.
Perhaps a bizarre cry for help...

Good stuff drummer man I was curious about Landis
and you posted the goods.

btw I was thinking about Robert Stigwood and Stig from the Rutles...

All these connections are driving me bananas.

[Ludwig]

Good stuff drummer man I was curious about Landis
and you posted the goods.

Anytime dude! Interesting guy that Landis. The more I read the more "hooked in" he seems, know what I mean?


btw I was thinking about Robert Stigwood and Stig from the Rutles...

All these connections are driving me bananas.[/quote]

WOW! That actually made me dizzy. The banana thing will come to us one day I'm sure of it, so to speak. " ;D "