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Post by SilverBeatle on Feb 19, 2004 17:00:48 GMT
No I'm not a doctor...but I do suffer from IBS. Therefore I believe I am somewhat of an authority on the subject
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Post by SunKing on Feb 19, 2004 17:14:13 GMT
No I'm not a doctor...but I do suffer from IBS. Therefore I believe I am somewhat of an authority on the subject Good. I am honoured.
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Post by SilverBeatle on Feb 19, 2004 17:18:36 GMT
...which is my whole beef with everything this Dr Wilmont is saying. It is all erroneous info on the subject of IBS. and regarding the link you posted for the doctor: members.tripod.com/~jbabs714/methh.htmDid you check the main page for that article? It's a site on automobile engines & fuel injection...look: members.tripod.com/~jbabs714/Nowhere on the main site above is there a link to the doctor's article. I think someone is pulling the wool over your eyes on this one SK. Certainly a legitimate doctor would have his own website (either that or Dr Wilmont is a mechanic first and a doctor second) We can argue in circles SK. I really don't see how and why you defend this guy's BS on IBS. Why can you not accept that on this one specfic point you are wrong? Give the IBS a rest please...it is making your argument abut PID look silly
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Post by raymi46 on Feb 19, 2004 18:17:49 GMT
Well, I'm not a doc, but I've worked with many as a nurse for over 20 years. Silverbeatle...all your facts are correct re:IBS. One more thing, there is no test for IBS, it is a "catch-all' disorder that is diagnosed after everything else has been ruled out. Furthermore physicians do NOT go around telling everyone about their patients, they could loose everything they have for that. Don't bother arguing, it's all a big lie so just blow it off.
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Post by innspector on Feb 19, 2004 23:14:45 GMT
:-/ouch!! This is getting hot
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Post by innspector on Feb 19, 2004 23:16:01 GMT
That was NOT for you innspector! You are doing a really good investigation here! Thanx, anyway, I think you are right with Mal
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Post by PaulBearer on Feb 20, 2004 2:36:07 GMT
Well, I'm not a doc, but I've worked with many as a nurse for over 20 years. Silverbeatle...all your facts are correct re:IBS. One more thing, there is no test for IBS, it is a "catch-all' disorder that is diagnosed after everything else has been ruled out. Well, therein may be the answer to this little mystery or apparent contradiction. Paul was poisoned in late 64; this created a real health problem for him, symptoms perhaps similar to IBS but unique to him. There would be some unpredictablity to just what that poison did to him. So perhaps IBS is a misnomer but it was diagnosed as such, this catch-all name, because everything else had been ruled out. Therefore what he needed to his particularly unqiue brand of "IBS" to ease his pain and the final rupture which killed him after being deprived of medication could very well be true.
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Post by raymi46 on Feb 20, 2004 3:44:21 GMT
There is no mystery. He may be JPM, but his body functions like everyone else. IBS is not caused by poisoning and it doesn't cause anything to "rupture" as you so aptly phrase it. I'm not replying to this anymore. This is way beyond rational. I'm an idiot for saying anything!
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Post by Perplexed on Feb 20, 2004 5:01:00 GMT
I lost my sis to bowel cancer; her businwss partner died a year earlier to the same kind of cancer; her best friend had Crohn's but lives today coping with it; my mom had transient bowel ischemia and had all her colon removed and 2/3rds of her ileum removed. Mom lived 9 days (in the hopital) with zero circulation to half her intestines. That was in 1990. She is alive and well today.
There are acute illness (sudded, intense, and potential life-threatening) of the bowels; there are chronic illnesses (on-going, gvenerally less intense, and gradually debilitating) diseases of the bowel.
A rupture from an injury (car wreck, fall, knife wound, gunshot, severe blow) could lead quickly to death. Also, appendicitis can kill you fast---all that poison released into the blood stream could bring about toxic shock, coma, organ failure, morbid infections.) If I am not mistaken, appendicitis can bring death within hours.
People live a long time, often, with Chrohn's and IBS nowadays. I don't know the general prognses in the 60's.
Stage 4 intestinal cancer(spreading to ovary, breast, lung,,lymph, etc.) is a very unpleasant thing to watch your sibling die from. Many tears.
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Post by innspector on Feb 20, 2004 16:11:41 GMT
Important numbers in James Paul Mc.Cartney's case:
3, 5, 9, 28
The first has been preety much unlocked,
number 5 is clear now too
#9 is still not very clear
28, now that is still a mystery, and I think this is a big clue number, a key indicator of something. More thinking has to be done around this one.
It appears in LMW28IF, and below the frame where is the white beetle. Can 28 be a date? a kilometer?, because my opinion is that 28 is not necessarily Paul's age in 1970, no, no. The beetle's plate in Abbey Road may have that meaning, but i'm sure it has a much greater clue, in the context that the frame number in the WA poster is 28, and that cannot be a coincidence.
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Post by Scatterdome on Feb 21, 2004 0:57:37 GMT
Scatterdome's theory has some good points. Thank you, Sun King. The "only" point where it's weak is that James Paul was "still" living until 1972. To set the record straight, while the original core of my theory puts the earliest likely date of James Paul’s death around ’73, I think the Klaatu-related addition to my theory is the most likely angle, meaning I now think the earliest likely date of his death was sometime in '81, during the recording of Klaatu’s last album, Magentalane, when session bass players were brought in to play on some of the tunes. (A strange development for a band that featured some of the best rock bass playing ever, supposedly by core member John Woloschuk, in its previous records.) Even given that, I also think it possible he’s still alive, having simply retired from music, or having formed another as-yet-unidentified band, or even having become a ghostwriter for various, random artists, after Klaatu’s demise. Just keeping you up to date, SK… I know you’ve got a lot of posts to keep track of. His background interpretation claims that because the "good" quality Faul's music production had until that date. Just my (not so) humble opinion. According to our last investigation it was Mal Evans that composed many songs attributed to Faul inside and outside the Beatles. In a interview Mal confessed that it was him to compose "Sgt. Pepper" -the song- Mal was the only one of Beatles staff to be on Faul's marriage cerimony with Linda. Mal is clearly the main promoter of "Let It Be" film and LP Mal's collaboration with Faul ended about on 1973-1974. I’m open to the idea, although I would need more concrete sources to back it up before I could consider that angle more deeply. If Mal was the man who composed some of the many great tunes Faul sang, then his collaboration with Faul ending around ’73-’74 would explain the decline in quality I hear in Faul’s albums after Band On The Run.People do you know who is a roadie? Well a roadie, to be THE BEATLES roadie has to be AT LEAST a musician. THE BEATLES were the best. Very probably they had THE BEST roadies too. Good point… we do know the Beatles certainly thought Mal was the best roadie they could have, since he stayed with them so long. That’s why I’m slightly open to the idea. Mal authoring Sgt.Pepper´s Lonely Hearts Club Band? He doesn´t looked like a guy who can compose a song, but appearences can be tricky, can´t they? Ringo himself wrote two songs (no offense Ring) Anyway, to make a statement like this, sources need to be detailed to back it up. While it’s known I don’t agree with all of innspector’s conclusions, I agree with this point. Until there’s more concrete facts to back up the idea of “Mal Evans: Songwriting Genius,” I’m sticking with my “5 living Beatles: Paul, Faul, John, George and Ringo” theory for now. It’s an interesting potential angle you propose, though, SK. Maybe we’ll hear more about it… Note to new readers- if you haven’t checked out my alternate theory, here’s the link to page 1: 60if.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=paul&action=display&thread=1063219993To old readers who haven’t checked out my theory since I began posting the Klaatu angle, here’s the link to page 5, where I first started speculating on Klaatu: 60if.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=paul&action=display&thread=1063219993
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Post by PaulBearer on Feb 21, 2004 10:42:31 GMT
What i'm trying to say is - this was no normal IBS if it really was any form of IBS. It may have been misdisagnosed. As I understand it, IBS is a "natural" disease, perhaps from birth or it develops later in life. But in Paul's case, it was the result of severe poisoning, quite likely an attempt on his life because he "said something wrong", and, while it didn't kill him, it destroyed/damaged his body system to the extent that he had the symptoms previously described. It may have been diagnosed as IBS as the "catch all" since nothing else fitted but...an unnatural way to get it so some rather unique qualities to it, including needing medication to keep it under control. So, definitely rather different from standard IBS, that's for sure!
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Post by SunKing on Feb 21, 2004 12:24:24 GMT
I lost my sis to bowel cancer; her businwss partner died a year earlier to the same kind of cancer; her best friend had Crohn's but lives today coping with it; my mom had transient bowel ischemia and had all her colon removed and 2/3rds of her ileum removed. Mom lived 9 days (in the hopital) with zero circulation to half her intestines. That was in 1990. She is alive and well today. There are acute illness (sudded, intense, and potential life-threatening) of the bowels; there are chronic illnesses (on-going, gvenerally less intense, and gradually debilitating) diseases of the bowel. A rupture from an injury (car wreck, fall, knife wound, gunshot, severe blow) could lead quickly to death. Also, appendicitis can kill you fast---all that poison released into the blood stream could bring about toxic shock, coma, organ failure, morbid infections.) If I am not mistaken, appendicitis can bring death within hours. People live a long time, often, with Chrohn's and IBS nowadays. I don't know the general prognses in the 60's. Stage 4 intestinal cancer(spreading to ovary, breast, lung,,lymph, etc.) is a very unpleasant thing to watch your sibling die from. Many tears. Perplexed your sensitivity and mind are always on the top. I know the truth as well. My task here is to let moving people to the truth by themselves. With pointing up threads. With reasoning over arguments. Now it's time to "sum up" all that. As soon as possible.
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Post by SilverBeatle on Feb 21, 2004 17:32:59 GMT
You cannot misdiagnose something that does not exist. The term "IBS" was even not in our vocabulary until 1967. Maybe Paul did have *other* stomach problems -- but to me that is not the issue here...the issue is the credibility of this Dr Wilmont character and the repeated use of his IBS statement as "evidence". I think we've shown beyond a shadow of a doubt that Wilmont is a fraud and I hope SK will stop using this quack's comments on IBS.
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Post by Perplexed on Feb 21, 2004 19:27:35 GMT
In viewing the outdoor versions of the videos for Paperback Writer and Rain, my impression of James Paul is that he is not feeling well, he seems peeked looking from a virus or hepatitis. I am not saying he has hepatitis, Iam saying his face and expressions look a little labored. Make-up can fix a lot, and the tight closeups of him are briefer and less many than the other 4 Beatles, who also look a little pensive. Well, that COULD be because they were directed that way. The closeups of George look especially deep, or sad, maybe they only wanted to capture "that look" but, why, in two optimistic songs? Ringo shows sadness and upbeatness in varying shots. John, facially, is always the enigma.
Dr. Wilmont has apparent spelling difficulties (so do I at thymes) and the origin of IBS as a handle may have been officially 1967, but sometimes the widespread use or general acceptance of a term is LATER than its first circulation. Certainly the general knowledge of such medical problems did exist.
But that he would violate a patients privacy-----and when did he ostensibly do this? And where is he today to back it up?
Of course, Elvis died (yes he's dead) and all kinds of info about his Doc and his drugs flooded the news. Every news story of his death (that I remember) included his "alleged" drug history--ongoing as well as at the time of his death. Was Elvis telling it or did the doctor? Who knew? were the pills by the toilet?
So, that doctor COULD tell, or be told on, is plausible. That he would write it out, knowing the repurcussions could be severe, seems a big stretch. And again, on scanning it a few times, the scrip just does not read, in my opiinion, believably.
That JP may have had need of internal medicine is possible, what, with his lifestyle and diet. Alcohol, insufficient rest, ppossibly inherited factors. Didnt this mother die of cancer? You can have intestinal cancer for a long tim and not know it before the symptoms become bad. Symptoms he might have ignored on so many tours.....and in 1966 there wasn't a lot they could do for it. It will make you miserable. My sis, who died from it, had 2 radical surgeries---too late. She would not do radiation or chemo. The end progression was rapid and pathetic. God rest her soul.
I am not saying JP ever had cancer. Just mulling again. With partial bowel removel, some survive the cancer and often live their lives at a lower weight. With less "surface" for absorption, more food, or calories, are required sometimes to keep the weight up.
It also seems hard to believe that a Dr. Wlimont could get away with writing that. Who was it ostensibly meant to read by? Certainly not a press release!
No offense----Paul might have been ill in '66, but so much emphasis on IBS is hard to take.
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Post by PaulBearer on Feb 22, 2004 10:50:57 GMT
Its also possible that Paul alwasys had it to some extent, maybe it was dormant or controllable; as you said, maybe inherited from his mother. If that is the case, then the severe food poisoning may have seriously excasberated the situation.
As regards to medical confidentiality, could it be that it expires a certain amount of time after the patient has died, 30 years say. I'm just guessing here but its possible.
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Post by SunKing on Feb 22, 2004 12:15:07 GMT
You cannot misdiagnose something that does not exist. The term "IBS" was even not in our vocabulary until 1967. Maybe Paul did have *other* stomach problems -- but to me that is not the issue here...the issue is the credibility of this Dr Wilmont character and the repeated use of his IBS statement as "evidence". I think we've shown beyond a shadow of a doubt that Wilmont is a fraud and I hope SK will stop using this quack's comments on IBS. 1- Sun King: Referta refero. 2- SilverBeatle wrote"...we've shown beyond a shadow of a doubt that Wilmont is a fraud" without any counter-evidence is just a totally non-sense. Dr Wilmont is not a "character". Just proved before in this thread. 3- SilverBeatle your hope is Sun King will stop this quack's comments.....and we are hoping you will stop your quack's comments without counter-evidences...so...
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Post by SunKing on Feb 23, 2004 10:37:32 GMT
Gigantic googoo!
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Post by SilverBeatle on Feb 23, 2004 13:06:45 GMT
Before you get too excited, the link to the methadone page on that *new* website still takes you to the same old mechanics homepage. This is not really a new link at all. Click on the link and the url transfers to: members.tripod.com/~jbabs714/methh.htmsame origin as the mechanics page: members.tripod.com/~jbabs714The key phrase (I put it in bold in the quote) is "unless a clear statement is made that a piece of advice offered is from a non-medically qualified individual or organisation" Go to the home page for that *new* site and read the disclaimer. They state clearly (as required by the above) that the info is offered by a non-medically qualified individual or organisation: www.masmith.inspired.net.au/about/about.htm" The information on this website should not be used as a substitute for getting medical advice, diagnosis and/or treatment from a qualified health professional. I'm a patient, not a doctor - the information I offer is based on my reading, and on my own experience and that of fellow sufferers. Links to other websites mean that I consider the information there may be of interest to you, but not necessarily that I endorse whatever theory or treatment is being promoted there. Don't believe anyone who says they can cure you!" That disclaimer is huge as it clears the site of any accountability AND therefore fits the HONcode criteria. Read the HONcode requirements again: www.hon.ch/HONcode/Conduct.htmlAll they ask you to do is either post information from qualified medical personel OR post a clear disclaimer. SO IN SHORT: THE REASON THAT WEBSITE FITS THE "HONcode" CRITERIA IS BECAUSE THEY POST A DISCLAIMER... NOT BECAUSE THE INFORMATION AND/OR SOURCE OF THE INFORMATION IS CREDIBLE AND/OR ON THE LEVEL. GIGANTIC SILVERBEATLE!
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Post by SilverBeatle on Feb 23, 2004 13:34:59 GMT
...and furthermore, I'll submit that " Dr David Wilmont" may well be a legitimate doctor. But just because Wilmont may be real does not mean that he necessarily wrote the piece about Paul and IBS. Someone *could* have found his name on the web and simply attributed their own writings to him
Case in point: note the same doctor that couldn't correctly spell "bowel" or "underwear" doesn't appear have the same spelling difficulties in the methadone piece. In fact he correctly spells words like "agonist", "promulgating", "bureaucratic", and "reappropriation". A little odd don't you think that this is the same guy who couldn't spell "bowel"?
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Post by PaulBearer on Feb 24, 2004 14:27:44 GMT
Well, maybe he used a spell-checker for the web article.
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Post by SunKing on Mar 16, 2004 14:18:01 GMT
...and besides you said Paul confirmed he had IBS in an interview. That is what I wanted to see. Well I've just found it: From a press conference at The Warwick Hotel in New York on August 22nd, 1966... Reporter: "Paul, according to wire reports, you became a little ill when you got off the plane last night. What happened there? Air sickness?" Paul: "Yes, something. I haven't been too well on the tour. I felt a bit ill, that's all, and I was sick."
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Post by Elidor on Mar 16, 2004 16:57:59 GMT
At risk of appearing pedantic, IBS is not a disease. "Syndrome" is a catch all term for a collection of symptoms. In the case of IBS these can range from abdominal pain to diarrhoea. It can't be contracted by virus or bacteria, and my medical dictionary does not associate it with food poinsoning. There is no treatment as such, and no specific cause. The symptoms are due to abnormal motility of the gut or to intestinal sensitivity to distension. It can be managed by dietary changes and anti-diarrhoea medication where necessary. 10% of the normal adult population suffer minor symptoms. To get a rough idea of what it can feel like, dring 10 or 11 pints of strong German lager, and follow this with a chilli chicken dosa before retiring for the evening. In seriousness though, Sun King said in reply to the question of where Paul admitted to having IBS: Well I've just found it: From a press conference at The Warwick Hotel in New York on August 22nd, 1966... Reporter: "Paul, according to wire reports, you became a little ill when you got off the plane last night. What happened there? Air sickness?" Paul: "Yes, something. I haven't been too well on the tour. I felt a bit ill, that's all, and I was sick." Sorry Sunking, I'm just not sure how this provides confirmation of anything other than Paul not feeling well. The tour wasn't cancelled, so it can't hav been that bad. Maybe he did eat something "off", but that's a far cry from concluding that he had developed IBS. And by the way, vomiting is definitely not a symptom of IBS.
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Post by Rojopa on Mar 16, 2004 17:14:52 GMT
Here is the picture of them getting off the plane: Paul has his hand on his stomach.
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Post by Rojopa on Mar 16, 2004 17:16:12 GMT
Didn't mean to say coming off the plane.
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