|
Post by TotalInformation on May 5, 2006 17:08:02 GMT
Ziggy Stardust is an amalgamation of PAUL MCCARTNEY and Valentine Michael Smith. You need to read Heinlein's Stranger in a Strange Land. (It will help you understand Crosby too.)
|
|
sweetlorettamartin
Contributor
You will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.
Posts: 70
|
Post by sweetlorettamartin on May 19, 2006 3:36:19 GMT
And Bowie's song "Is There Life On Mars" has some interesting lyrics...I think someone posted it someplace else, but it's surely an obsession with rock stars in the 60's and early 70's....
|
|
|
Post by Perplexed on May 24, 2006 9:00:12 GMT
Well, yes, ouvrir is the infinitive for "to open" in French. Problem is, ouvrir is an irregular "ir" ending werb, and the rules state that it would be "tu ouvres", or "vous ouvrez." There is no z or s. And, there is an adjective form of "ouvrir" that is "ouvré", but it has an accent, and an adjective makes no sense just before a direct article/noun. And it appears to be a command, as there is no subject, no pronoun. So, it is in the imperative form. "Open the dog" does not satisfy, though, to my ears. Now, the word "ouvrer" is a possibility. It means "work", thnough that word has largely been supplanted by "travailler". Also, the form of conjugation is right. www.verbix.com/webverbix/go.asp?D1=3&H1=140&T1=ouvrerAccording to the above, these are the imperitive forms of the word: Impératif tu ouvre nous ouvrons vous ouvrez "tu" is the intimate, friendly "you" in French. Personal. Used between people who are known to each other. And no "tu" is used in the imperatif. So, "ouvre le chien" would then be a command to, "Work the dog." And, Zane? A proper name, I guess. Totally unrelated: la.indymedia.org/news/2005/04/124922.phpWoah. How unusual. Sad. I must hear his music.
|
|
Soothsayer
Contributor
A knight at the crossroads
Posts: 135
|
Post by Soothsayer on Jul 3, 2006 20:12:55 GMT
hello everyone!! Firstly, I'm very pleased and honoured to be a part of this magnificent forum, many thanks for having me.. secondly, yes, the David Bowie connection is pretty unsubtle to say the least, my eldest brother went to school in Bromley with DB, and when he met up with him several years later, he did actually mention a connection between the original Paul and the character of Ziggy, my brother thought that it was the drink talking, as they were having a few beers at the time, and DB was renowned for obscure wind-ups esp. when intoxicated!! The other thing that was mentioned was how the rest of the Beatles used to take the mick out of Faul, it was their way of dealing with the huge mess that they'd inadvertantly got into; by injecting humour into the whole facade, it somehow became more acceptable. Faul became quite egotistic, and actually began to believe that he had somehow become the original Paul, John, more than the others, used to remind him of his mortal status by criticising in particular his stage performance, the line 'John, I'm only dancing, don't get me wrong, she turns me on' is a direct reference to this, and also includes the 'turn me on' clue. When the humour wore off, it became obvious that the whole bizarre episode simply didn't sit right with some, and there was certainly a desire by John and certain others, DB included, to expose the truth.
|
|
|
Post by TotalInformation on Jul 3, 2006 21:11:05 GMT
Wow, Bowie spoke that frankly with your brother about the two Pauls? That's awesome! Do you know how he referred to PAUL 2.0?
|
|
Ludwig
Contributor
"It's all in the mind."
Posts: 101
|
Post by Ludwig on Jul 3, 2006 22:30:00 GMT
Holy smokes Soothsayer! Welcome and thanks for sharing. Please tell us more!
|
|
|
Post by plastic paul on Jul 3, 2006 22:57:31 GMT
Welcome, love to hear more where that came from.
|
|
Soothsayer
Contributor
A knight at the crossroads
Posts: 135
|
Post by Soothsayer on Jul 3, 2006 23:26:18 GMT
Hi again. Sorry to be vague, but it was one of those drunken mad conversations that, at the time, my brother didn't think too much of, so the details are pretty hazy for those reasons.. regarding Paul 2, from what i understand, David just referred to him as 'the new guy', there was no mention of any names or any other details, (unsurprisingly).. DB has always been very anti-establishment, I think thats why the lyrics of his songs that relate to this, are so graphic and challenging. The Beatles were under direct scrutiny at all times, and threats were probably made to them and their families, to ensure that the operation wasn't exposed. It was probably easier for other artists that were aware, but not directly involved, to inform the masses of what was going on. My brother had just started a band at the time, and was sending off demos to various record co.s, DB kept warning him about the dangers of getting 'chewed up in the system' as he put it, and he was trying to get the point across of how ruthless and twisted the top dogs are, I'm pretty sure thats how the conversation came about.
|
|
Soothsayer
Contributor
A knight at the crossroads
Posts: 135
|
Post by Soothsayer on Jul 3, 2006 23:53:01 GMT
Just read back thru the other posts in this topic., I know for a fact that DB always referred to bosses or leaders as 'dogs', my brother reminded me of this, as he found it amusing for some reason(!), anyway, don't know if it sheds any light on previous questions.. Will see if I can get any more info regarding lyrics, I'm sure something was mentioned about 'mott the hoople' as well, but I honestly can't remember what., not much help, sorry.
|
|
|
Post by TotalInformation on Jul 4, 2006 0:04:32 GMT
The song Bowie wrote for mott/hoople does seem to be about musicians spreading the PID word: -------------------------------- Well Billy rapped all night about his suicide How he kick it in the head when he was twenty-five Speed jive don't want to stay alive When you're twenty-five [...] All the young dudes (Hey dudes) Carry the news (Where are ya) Boogaloo dudes (Stand up Come on) Carry the news All the young dudes (I want to hear you) Carry the news (I want to see you) Boogaloo dudes (And I want to talk to you all of you) Carry the news [...] But we can love oh yes we can love And my brother's back at home with his Beatles and his Stones We never got it off on that revolution stuff [...] ---------------------------
although I think the more conventional interpretation focuses on allusions to the "glam" underground homo/bisexual scene
|
|
|
Post by Perplexed on Jul 4, 2006 1:47:42 GMT
hello everyone!! Firstly, I'm very pleased and honoured to be a part of this magnificent forum, many thanks for having me.. secondly, yes, the David Bowie connection is pretty unsubtle to say the least, my eldest brother went to school in Bromley with DB, and when he met up with him several years later, he did actually mention a connection between the original Paul and the character of Ziggy, my brother thought that it was the drink talking, as they were having a few beers at the time, and DB was renowned for obscure wind-ups esp. when intoxicated!! The other thing that was mentioned was how the rest of the Beatles used to take the mick out of Faul, it was their way of dealing with the huge mess that they'd inadvertantly got into; by injecting humour into the whole facade, it somehow became more acceptable. Faul became quite egotistic, and actually began to believe that he had somehow become the original Paul, John, more than the others, used to remind him of his mortal status by criticising in particular his stage performance, the line 'John, I'm only dancing, don't get me wrong, she turns me on' is a direct reference to this, and also includes the 'turn me on' clue. When the humour wore off, it became obvious that the whole bizarre episode simply didn't sit right with some, and there was certainly a desire by John and certain others, DB included, to expose the truth. Yea verily, and forsooth! You've said more in one paragraph than many have been able to say in three years. Well, I wish that the entire thing, especially as much water has gone under the bridge, could just be infused with a great measure of good humor and relaxed, open acceptance. But, who am I kidding? Thanks for posting. That was a h*ll of a post. Please hang around.
|
|
|
Post by beatled on Jul 4, 2006 2:10:56 GMT
A site with a Mott the Hoople lyrics restoration project, a most fine endeavor. The lyrics for Hymn for the Dudes are on this page. Something caught my eye BIG time: I got an idea Go tell the superstar All his hairs are turning grey Star-spangled fear As all the people disappear The limelight fades away Cos if you think you are a star For so long they'll come from near and far But you'll forget just who you are (yes you will)
You ain't the nazz You're just a buzz Some kinda temporary
I know I don't have to explain this one to TI, but "The Nazz" possibly connects to "Hey Jude" which has the line "make it Jude" which is also a line from the Lord Buckley routine "The Nazz"... More about that here.
|
|
Soothsayer
Contributor
A knight at the crossroads
Posts: 135
|
Post by Soothsayer on Jul 5, 2006 19:59:47 GMT
I think 'Freddy' was a reference to Freddie Mercury. I read that somewhere.. regarding the previous posts about the words 'ouvrir le chien' or 'ouvre le chien' , in another Bowie song, based on DB's definitions of 'dogs' as the elite, or bosses in the establishment, perhaps 'ouvrir le chien' is a suggestion to expose the actions of those at the top?? just a thought , but it seems to make sense. Thanks for your kind words, Doc.
|
|
|
Post by TotalInformation on Jul 5, 2006 20:11:17 GMT
Was Freddie Mercury around in 1972? RELEASE THE HOUNDS!
|
|
Soothsayer
Contributor
A knight at the crossroads
Posts: 135
|
Post by Soothsayer on Jul 5, 2006 20:37:10 GMT
Queen officially formed in '71 and got a contract with EMI in '73. I believe prior to that Freddie was part of the glam scene big time, and already had a name for himself in certain circles, if this was Mott the Hoople's bag as well, it's possible the reference was about him. I do remember a really early Queen vid where Freddie actually had silver stars on his face, but can't remember what the track was.
|
|
|
Post by plastic paul on Jul 6, 2006 0:58:53 GMT
Lol, superb TI, one might say "excellent!"
So who are "Diamond Dogs" then (considering Bowie see's himself as a dog on that album...)?
|
|
|
Post by Perplexed on Jul 6, 2006 3:15:47 GMT
Was Freddie Mercury around in 1972? RELEASE THE HOUNDS! DITHERS! DITHERS! Interesting question, Total. After sniffing about on Google for a mo', I gleaned from several sources that Queen was formed in 1970. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_(band)I use the "wiki" so often; I am beginning to smell the stench of "lame researcher" on my breath......but the 1970 date is shown frequently. Maybe it's a NWO lie. Maybe there never WAS a Queen until 1980, and it's evidence of the false memory syndrome induced by contrails. OMG NO! All of my brain tissue is awash in aluminum tricylicate, prions............and Febreze™.
|
|
|
Post by TotalInformation on Jul 6, 2006 3:39:40 GMT
So, if Freddie M. was one of the young dudes deuptized to spread the news (oh boy), is Scaramouche the Fool on the hill?
|
|
Soothsayer
Contributor
A knight at the crossroads
Posts: 135
|
Post by Soothsayer on Jul 6, 2006 10:24:02 GMT
The following quote comes from the history section of the official Queen website, which is endorsed by Brian May, so should be accurate; "Queen formed in 1971 and in 1973 signed their first recording contract for EMI. That year they released their first album, QUEEN. The same year saw their first major UK tour, and in 1974 they released QUEEN II as well as making their first UK headlining tour. They made their first US tour, and in November released SHEER HEART ATTACK which was a hit on both sides of the Atlantic. " queen-fip.com (official site) Queen, David Bowie & Ian Hunter performed 'All the Young Dudes' in memory of Freddie at a tribute concert in 1992, but as yet I can't find anything to suggest that DB knew Freddie at the time he wrote the track., it's also notable that the name is spelt with a 'Y' in the song, not 'ie' so maybe it is a coincidence.
|
|
Soothsayer
Contributor
A knight at the crossroads
Posts: 135
|
Post by Soothsayer on Jul 6, 2006 10:40:23 GMT
Freddie was the main man, and I'm sure he'd have spread the word admirably, with his usual grace, wit & charm!! Wonder if there were any daffodills on that hill?., (Or am I being ridiculous daahlings?..)
|
|
|
Post by Perplexed on Jul 7, 2006 9:17:00 GMT
Freddie was the main man, and I'm sure he'd have spread the word admirably, with his usual grace, wit & charm!! Wonder if there were any daffodills on that hill?., (Or am I being ridiculous daahlings?..) Freddie did have his charms. Here's one of the charmer songs: "Loverboy" I can dim the lights and sing you songs full of sad things We can do the tango just for two I can serenade and gently play on your heart strings Be your valentino just for you Ooh love - ooh loverboy What're you doin' tonight, hey boy Set my alarm, turn on my charm That's because I'm a good old-fashioned lover boy Ooh let me feel your heartbeat (Grow faster, faster) Ooh ooh can you feel my love heat Come on and sit on my hot-seat of love And tell me how do you feel right after-all I'd like for you and I to go romancing Say the word - your wish is my command Ooh love - ooh loverboy What're you doin' tonight, hey boy Write my letter Feel much better And use my fancy patter on the telephone When I'm not with you I think of you always (I miss those long hot summer nights) I miss you When I'm not with you Think of me always Love you - love you Hey boy where do you get it from Hey boy where did you go ? I learned my passion in the good old Fashioned school of loverboys Dining at the Ritz we'll meet at nine precisely One two three four five six seven eight nine o' clock I will pay the bill, you taste the wine Driving back in style, in my saloon will do quite nicely Just take me back to yours that will be fine (Come on and get it) Ooh love, (There he goes again just like a good old-fashioned lover boy) Ooh loverboy What're you doin' tonight, hey boy Everything's all right Just hold on tight That's because I'm a good old-fashioned fashioned lover boy. That's a hard song to sing--the range and melody. Very tricky. Pun intended. Man, he could sing too. But, as far as David Bowie goes, hard to me to guess. His lyrics can be very pointed--and to me, he seems to be one to make artsy, deep statements in his work. Witty, savvy man. But, could he know anything about the Beatle mystery? Hard to guess.
|
|
|
Post by mistermoonlight on Aug 8, 2006 15:03:59 GMT
To get back to the thin white duke:
-------------- Fame (feat. John Lennon) 1975
Fame, (fame) makes a man take things over Fame, (fame) lets him loose, hard to swallow Fame, (fame) puts you there where things are hollow Fame (fame)
Fame, its not your brain, its just the flame That burns your change to keep you insane (sane) Fame (fame)
Fame, (fame) what you like is in the limo Fame, (fame) what you get is no tomorrow Fame, (fame) what you need you have to borrow Fame (fame)
Fame, nien! its mine! is just his line To bind your time, it drives you to, crime Fame (fame)
Could it be the best, could it be? Really be, really, babe? Could it be, my babe, could it, babe? Could it, babe? , could it, babe?
Is it any wonder I reject you first? Fame, fame, fame, fame Is it any wonder you are too cool to fool Fame (fame)
Fame, bully for you, chilly for me Got to get a rain check on pain (pain) (fame)
Fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame ,fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame, fame Fame Whats your name?
Feeling so gay, feeling gay -------------------------------
I get the feeling Bowie really can't stand Faul!!
|
|
|
Post by mistermoonlight on Aug 9, 2006 10:59:45 GMT
You sure about that Byrds?
|
|
|
Post by Perplexed on Aug 10, 2006 7:08:46 GMT
You sure about that Byrds? T'oh!
|
|
|
Post by mistermoonlight on Aug 10, 2006 14:39:44 GMT
Hahaha, would you care to shine your light on the lyrics of 'Fame', oh Lyrics Master Byrds?
|
|