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Post by SunKing on Aug 11, 2003 12:26:30 GMT
the best argument against the Faul theory is that, whoever was living under the McCartney name wrote some really great songs until the end of the Beatles. I'm thinking of Wild Honey Pie, Blackbird, and Rocky Raccoon in particular. Does anyone have details on how these were written? Sorry Faul wrote NONE of that songs. Beatles' aim was to publish the musical material left by James Paul. Faul was just a singer that could imitate James Paul's voice. "Apple" means "A Paul" Ltd |
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Post by SunKing on Aug 11, 2003 12:54:04 GMT
Yes!  |
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Matt
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Post by Matt on Aug 11, 2003 18:08:50 GMT
???jae i'm incredulous like you about the song backlog theory. according to it, the faulpaul songs released on "let it be" and "abbey road" would've been written by paul back in '65 or '66, before he supposedly died! but those songs show a clear evolution from the earlier songs! i know it's only 3.5 years, but 1966 to 1969 makes a BIG DIFFERENCE in pop music history! those were revolutionary times in rock 'n roll.
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Post by SunKing on Aug 11, 2003 20:13:12 GMT
Yes, an "arrangement " evolution. But the melodies never die.... In the early '70 there was a big "hit" based on "Beethoven 5th Symphony" theme...so...  |
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Post by Eggman on Aug 11, 2003 22:30:14 GMT
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Post by LUCY on Aug 12, 2003 3:11:06 GMT
well,
they were the original "B0y Band"
talent+ help+$$$$$$$
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Post by Uberkinder on Aug 12, 2003 3:29:31 GMT
I'm a non-professional songwriter myself, and even I have hundreds upon hundreds of songs and melodies lying around on tapes and notebooks all over the place, and I'm only 20.
I'm not saying they are all great, but I'll put it this way, take the best thing I ever wrote, whether it be great or not, and compare my other songs to it; I'd say I have at least a hundred songs backlogged that are up to the standard of my best song.
Ray Davies of The Kinks, my "idol" if you care for that term, is another good example. He has released around 20 albums over the past 30-40 years containing around 12 songs each, and yet the Kinks have a backlog of unreleased material from those years large enough to fill several volumes, and most of it is really good.
Did you ever consider this? Most bands have unreleased tracks all over the place. How many unreleased Paul McCartney songs came with the Beatles Anthology? I can count them on my fingers; and yet most big name artists I listen to like Pink Floyd, They Might Be Giants, The Kinks etc., have dozens and dozens of unreleased tracks; enough to fill several albums.
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Matt
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Post by Matt on Aug 12, 2003 4:08:26 GMT
I don't question that Paul could've had a considerable backlog by 1966. But my contention is that the songs released subsequently as his show a marked evolution, not just in arrangement but in lyrical content, concept, and overal gestalt. They mature. They show consideration of and response to the changing social atmosphere of the times.
I'm currently looking into this subject so I'll follow it up later.
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Post by PaulBearer on Aug 12, 2003 4:20:33 GMT
In the Beatles 4 Sale album (1964), there was a blurb about how they still had enough unreleased songs, that if they released one a month, they wouldn't run out until 1975! So, how many songs is that?
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Post by TotalInformation on Aug 12, 2003 4:52:05 GMT
11 * 12 = 132
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Post by onlooker on Aug 12, 2003 6:37:01 GMT
Uberkinder, I'm a songwriter, too. I totally agree with you about the backlog of songs; I've got about 100 that haven't seen the light of day (some of which should never). Funnily enough, some of the songs I wrote back in 1978 sound more "mature" or possible more relevant today than some of the fresh ones. In other words, it doesn't seem far-fetched to me that there could be years worth of Paul songs to flesh out the Beatles songbook. BTW, I'm also a huge Kinks fan - Ray is the epitome of songwriting, both back in the 60's and now. He is an acquaintance of mine, and I can assure you he has an ENORMOUS load of unpublished/unpresented songs.  |
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Post by SunKing on Aug 12, 2003 10:12:31 GMT
Hey Friends, please don't forget John Lennon & George Martin's GREAT work on that musical material! P.S. I am a musican too (from about 30 years) and I have TONS of unpublished material.... |
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Post by Eggman on Aug 12, 2003 13:29:27 GMT
I have just one published. It calls "Hello Goodbye" ;D ;D Sorry one of my stupid jokes!!!! |
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Post by rogermexico on Aug 12, 2003 18:45:47 GMT
Seems to me that there might be some confusion as to how many songs we're actually talking about here.
It seems to be taken more or less as read that the real Paul wrote everything that he's generally credited with on "Sgt. Pepper" and that songs such as Blackbird and Rocky Racoon were part of his backlog.
If so, that doesn't leave too much.
Look at "Abbey Road" for example. At a guess, you could say Maxwell's Silver Hammer sounds like a Paul song - but as for the rest... I don't think so. It's also odd that most of the second side is taken up with a lengthy medley where a large number of odds and ends are gathered together. Strange that...
Think about it - we're not talking about several album's worth of songs here, really.
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Matt
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Post by Matt on Aug 12, 2003 19:07:22 GMT
"You never give me your money", "She came in through the bathroom window" and "Golden slumbers" could only have been written by Paul. Listen to the melodies!
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Post by SunKing on Aug 12, 2003 20:48:51 GMT
Jae,
please don't confuse the melody, the harmony, the lyrics, with the "whole" song.
I could have a good melody then I could add an harmony then the words.
What James Paul left are mainly melodies or short complete songs like "Her Majesty".
Do you notice that "the last" James Paul songs are mainly "guitar & voice" as he liked to record songs staying in a hotel room?
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Post by Rojopa on Aug 13, 2003 3:36:48 GMT
In Anthology 8 I believe, Faul said that he changed the word Jules to Jude because it was a mouthful. Paul could have written the song about John's son Julian, but was changed after his death. Jules doesn't seem like a mouthful to me.
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Post by Renee on Aug 13, 2003 3:43:22 GMT
Maybe he was afraid of sounding anti-Sematic. If you sing "Hey Jules" aloud a few times, it begins to resemble "Hey Jews!".  |
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Matt
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Post by Matt on Aug 13, 2003 3:50:37 GMT
Apparently John was drunk in a bar at some point in the seventies (surprise surprise), and he related to someone that "Hey Jude" was originaly written about Brian Epstein. The title was "Gay Jew". True story! |
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Post by Renee on Aug 13, 2003 3:52:49 GMT
Shame on you, Johnny.
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Post by PaulBearer on Aug 13, 2003 4:29:05 GMT
Once Upon A Long Ago
Picking up scales and broken chords
Puppy dog tails in the House of Lords
Tell me darling, what can it mean?
Making up moons in a minor key
What have those tunes got to do with me?
Tell me darling, where have you been?
Once upon a long ago
Children searched for treasure
Nature's plan went hand in hand with pleasure.
Such pleasure
Blowing baloons on a windy day
Desolate dunes with a lot to say
Tell me darling, what have you seen?
Once upon a long ago
Children searched for treasure
Nature's plan went hand in hand with pleasure.
My pleasure
Playing guitars on an empty stage
Counting the bars of an iron cage
Tell me darling, what can it mean?
Picking up scales and broken chords
Puppy dog tails in the House of Lords
Tell me darling, what can it mean?
Once upon a long ago...
It appears to me that the above song of Faul's is making reference to picking up the bits and pieces or strands of songs that have nothing to do with him.
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Post by TotalInformation on Aug 13, 2003 4:41:04 GMT
House of Lords / House of Paul
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Post by Renee on Aug 13, 2003 6:37:36 GMT
I'm getting quite a different meaning....  |
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Post by SunKing on Aug 13, 2003 9:49:36 GMT
Apparently John was drunk in a bar at some point in the seventies (surprise surprise), and he related to someone that "Hey Jude" was originaly written about Brian Epstein. The title was "Gay Jew". True story! Friends! That's REALLY an AMAZING news! Please, the source! |
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Post by Beatlestobattle on Aug 19, 2003 2:33:15 GMT
First off, an apple is a fruit. A Paul is a person. There is no way you could mistake the two. If they wanted to be that blatant, they should have just stuck his mug on the record label of every Apple artist and called it a Paul McCartney record. How's THAT for a creative blitz?
Second off, John made many drunken remarks that weren't all necessarily true. The "Gay Jew" anecdote may have been made up as a joke at a party.
Third off, why should we believe that Paul had to have written these songs in 1966? Here's something for you conspiratologists to chew on, he and John collaborated on at least 100 songs in 1959 that were still in existence throughout the Beatles' career and used to fill up their records when needed. The text for those existed until Linda threw it out during cleanup at home.
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